Compiled Messages: ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 62 posted by William Gibbs (COS5223) on Tue Mar 20, 2001 23:39 Subject Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Do you believe that media have an influence on learning? Or do you believe that media have no influence on learning? What is your stand on this issue after reading the two articles assigned? State what your stand is on the issue (i.e., you either believe that media have an influence on learning or that media have no influence on learning). Provide reasons or arguments to justify your chosen position or stand. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 65 [Branch from no. 62] posted by Cynthia Cloutier (cucec4) on Wed Mar 28, 2001 09:06 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 I believe that media does have an influence on learning. I thought so before reading the 2 assigned articles and I still think so. I disagree with article 1--its main argument seems to be that "Media and their attributes have important influences on the cost or speed of learning but only the use of instructional methods will influence learning." I don't think so. Yes, instructional methods will influence learning, but so will media. In article 2 there were successful interactions in two environments: one in computers and one with video. I think that more research will just keep confirming that media does influence learning. I find it hard to believe that anyone would think that media doesn't influence learning. How could it not? Everything around us influences our learning--the environment, the people in class with you, what instructor you have, the material used, the work assigned, etc. The media used would influence learning just like everything else influences learning. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 72 [Branch from no. 65] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Mon Apr 02, 2001 22:07 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Cindy: It is clear that we share the same point of view on this issue. In reading your comment, something struck me. I wonder if we could almost use method and media synonymously. What are your thoughts on this? ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 75 [Branch from no. 72] posted by Cynthia Cloutier (cucec4) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 15:20 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Patricia, Yes, I think that method and media could ALMOST be used synonymously. Before taking this class I would have thought so for sure. I think that the type of media used in instruction could be considered part of the method of teaching. I believe that the two are very closely related. The main difference I see between them is that method is a process while media can be defined as something of a physical nature (paper, video, pictures, etc.). ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 108 [Branch from no. 75] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:51 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Cynthia, I agree that media and methods can be similar they are often not synonomus. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 107 [Branch from no. 72] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:50 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Hi, I do not believe that media and methods of instruction are the same. I believe that they can be used to reach the same goal of say. . .teaching a specific skill. A variety of media/mediums/ and instruction techniques could be used to reach that goal. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 85 [Branch from no. 65] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 16:19 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Cindi, I agree with you. I too feel that media, if used with sound judgement can be an asset to the learning process. Some researchers set out to answer what they think they already know. So the research is done from their prospective, any thing that deviates from their goal is put by the wayside. That does not happen often but it does happen. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 92 [Branch from no. 85] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 22:38 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Joe: I think most research is framed around the reference of what is already known, and difficult to really look genuinely at the topic being explored. That is why I think it is useful to utilize observers in processes they are not necessarily experts on. I heard of a case in which two groups of students were asked to build a prototype of a vehicle that would be most economic in terms of energy. The group of advanced automotive engineering students came up with a model that was not nearly as effective as one designed by a mixed group of liberal arts students. Though charged with the same task, the advanced students were certainly more confined by their knowledge, than those that had no previous frame of reference. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 95 [Branch from no. 92] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sat Apr 07, 2001 01:18 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Nice point Patricia. There is also the case of the doctor who discovered that almost all ulcers were caused by a virus. This went against mainstream knowledge and so it was undiscovered for decades. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 110 [Branch from no. 95] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:01 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Tess, No matter how advanced we become, things really do stay the same. Look at how the person that created th vaccine for rabies was treated. In our recent past remember the person who discovered how to extract the plasma, and platelets from blood to perfect blood transfusions. An invention that was created with technology. Look what happened to the inventor. He died after an auto accident, he bled to death because he wasn't allowed into a "white" hospital. So just because we have the technology to use media, our culture hasn't grown exponentially with it. I agree that humans just might be detrimental to the advancement of media as a form of teaching tool. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 138 [Branch from no. 110] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:03 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Linda, I didn't realize that that had happened to the man who perfected the blood transfusions. Thank you for telling me. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 152 [Branch from no. 138] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 04:02 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Using technology can also be a wonderful way to continue the old fashion cocept of story telling. It can give information to students in such a way that they learn about and from the past, both the good and the bad. You hope they will remember. But we should use technology to our advantage. Young people of today are comfortable with it. If that is within the realm of their world then we must enter their world to get their attention . Technology is a good example of how students today can be reached, no matter what their level. Technology can aide in that old saying that "every child can learn". It is up to us to be able to use technology as the key. But before we can, we have to be taught not only what it is but how to be comfortable enough with it to use it. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 109 [Branch from no. 85] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:54 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Cindy and Joe, I think that we need to be very careful of studies and who pays for the studies and what results they are looking for if often influenced by the above details. So in the two articles we were reading, I WAS wondering why they chose this particular topic, and who was going to benefit from the results Linda . ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 106 [Branch from no. 65] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:47 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Cynthia, I agree with you that administrators will always be thinking of the cost of a media/medium as opposed to the affectiveness of it being the proiority. I do agree with you that media does influence learning. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 66 [Branch from no. 62] posted by Liza Vaughn (culbv) on Wed Mar 28, 2001 21:01 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 I believe that media have an influence on learning. Reinforcement of instruction is made clearer, resulting in the happening of "learning" through the involvement of media such as computers and / or video. I found article one confusing and unsupportive. The cost of media is important, but so is the message of the instruction. If learning doesn't happen, then the cost of traditional instruction has been wasted. Invoking media to enhance learning is priceless compared to the alternative, which is not learning. Article 2 was much clearer - explained and supported media to enhance learning. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 68 [Branch from no. 66] posted by Cynthia Cloutier (cucec4) on Thu Mar 29, 2001 13:39 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Liza, I agree with you that article 1 was confusing and very unsupportive. I got along much better with article 2 and found it interesting, if not relieving, that some evidence is being found to support that media does influence learning. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 112 [Branch from no. 68] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:06 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Liza, and Cynthia, I concur, the argument supporting the or opinion that media does influence learning was a clearly written paper. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 70 [Branch from no. 66] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Mon Apr 02, 2001 22:02 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 I think the intent of the first article was not to be confusing, but clearly that he does NOT support the statement that the use of media results in learning. I agree with your statement that if learning does not result due to traditional learning that it too is a waste, and that learning, not cost should be the bottom line. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 113 [Branch from no. 70] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:13 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Patricia, Unfortunately, in the educational setting, at least in the elementary schools. The bottom line on everything is cost. A good example was the Reading Program, Reading Recovery. With the type of media, medium used, it was a very expensive program. It also had extremely good resultsl. The results were that remedial readers were accerlerated to be average and above average readers after 1st grade and that they usually did not need to receive help in the 2nd, 3rrd, or 4th grades and above. The results of this wonderful program was the savings to the district of the price of extra title one and L.D. teachers. However, because of the prohibitive financial cost, this successful program that used technology was stopped in our district. Guess who was really the loser? As always, the student. So believe me, students do not often come first. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 130 [Branch from no. 113] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:16 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Linda: While I recognize I am waffling on my media argument, I can't help but think there are some valuable methods that the accelerated reading program provided that could continue to be utilized. In fact, utilizing the Accelerated Learning model our group provided for class could be utilized and probably come up with similar results, and very little costs -- especially if it was directly related to technology (as it sounds like it was). ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 153 [Branch from no. 130] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 04:05 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Patricia, Honestly, you do have a good point. School districts do have to stay with in a budget. However, I do believe that if TEACHERS were asked how to effectly use some of that money, the distribution would be a little different. Technology would be one of the areas. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 111 [Branch from no. 66] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:03 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Lisa, You were very articulate in your opinion. I wish I could have said it as nicely as you. You were right on the money. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 67 [Branch from no. 62] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Wed Mar 28, 2001 21:17 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 While I have always believed that media strongly influences learning, I have to admit, that I could almost agree with the first article. The strong points of support he gives to the fact that characteristics/attributes of one form of media can also be found in another, less expensive form are valid. However the point he seems to underscore here is that it is our duty as teachers, educators, and trainers to provide the best economic option. After being forced to reflect on the two articles I am still of the belief that media does indeed influence learning. The two examples given in support of this theory, in the second article, illustrate that media not only result in learning, but at an even higher and applicable level. Being able to apply prinicples to real life or varying scenarios seems to be the best measure of learning. In fact, it seems that the use of media enabled the learning to occur as the result of its inherent characteristics/attributes -- unique or not. That specific characteristic was precisely aligned with the needs of the learner's brain -- providing them with the appropriate encoding vehicle for the new information/concept/process. Without the media, the environment that fostered continued processing via open discussion, note taking, brainstorming, probing questions, and continued discovery would not have occurred. While new material may initially seem easy, it is not until one digs deeper that its complexity is reavealed. After further discovery and processing, the information, once again, appears easy. I believe that it is our responsibility to learners to provide the type of environment that best meets their needs. It seems to follow then that the use of the appropriate media to help stimulate learners learning styles is how cost effectiveness should be measured. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 151 [Branch from no. 67] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 03:56 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Patricia, Your comments were well written and well thought out. It is truly difficult to separate if technology is the instrucment that enhanses learning. But I have to agree with you that regardless of the speculation. It must inspire students to "think". If that goal is accomplished. That is a great deal!!!!Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 74 [Branch from no. 62] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Mon Apr 02, 2001 22:37 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Although I agree that media has an influence on learning. I have come to see it somewhat differently then I had at the beginning of this class. Media does have an effect on the learning process only to the students that react to the various media that are used. There are students that can gain from a lecture driven class quite well using just the spoken word if, the instructor has a well executed plan of lectures. Where another student would like to have reinforcement with video, be it vcr, 16mm projector, or slides. The media in that case does not matter, only that it is used. I found that in the second article that computers and video were two examples of success with media. Those using the 'ThinkerTools' demonstrated a much greater improve­ment and scored higher than the high school students who been taught about using traditional methods. Using computers actively in class can also be a plus for those students that are confortable with it. So, in closing I guess I straddle the fence on this one since I have refined my responses to this question. I must say I feel that this question has more than one answer. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 114 [Branch from no. 74] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:22 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 21 to 28 Joe, I too believe that the learner has a responsibility for their own learning and that media can play a part in that. But there also comes a time when the learner does not know what or how to ask the correct questions. It is then that that the educators must use what ever technique and material they can to effectively transfer that knowledge to the learner. It may take many attempts and the educator may fail, for a variety of reasons. But that failure can be used to motivate the teacher to come up with other ideas too. So media can influence learning, the potential is there. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 63 posted by William Gibbs (COS5223) on Tue Mar 20, 2001 23:43 Subject Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 During the time period from March 29 to April 11, you are asked to log on to this forum for an average of 15 minutes every other day. Please contribute at least one message per session. In your messages, engage in a discussion (about the influence of media on learning) with other students by reading and responding to their messages. You can express your agreement or disagreement, ask questions, provide additional opinions, and so on. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 83 [Branch from no. 63] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 22:47 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Professor Gibbs, I have commented in the earlier section. Are we supposed to comment here as well? Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 93 [Branch from no. 83] posted by William Gibbs (COS5223) on Fri Apr 06, 2001 13:36 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess, yes, please comment or continue the discussion here as well. Thanks ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 84 [Branch from no. 63] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 15:56 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 I think that different media in the educational process can be an effective way to get students motivated, if the instructor used the ASSURE model to determine the likes and characteristics, competencies, and learning styles of the students attending. Educators can help students gain the knowledge and cerebral thinking that they need, by using media judiciously (clearly state the objectives). Children and young adults' nowadays at least in our society obtain a large portion of their information from the media. Be it, television, or other media it helps them to scrutinize what they see and react to it in a positive manner. The learners can then compare these different media to get a more complete view of the world around them. My thoughts go back to Kindergarten when the teacher was showing flash cards (media) for the letter A 'a is for apple, with an image of a large red apple'. It was much more impressive then the spoken word to have a card raised to the class.So media has been around for many years to assist in the learning. Also, as you may know the Armed Services have taken one from the Electronic Games People. They are using ultra modern VR machines for pilot, tanks, and other highly developed weaponry for their training purposes. The training the pilots is created in such a way as to give needed training on different malfunctions that the aircraft can have, without endangering any lives or aircraft in the process. Methods are important in the learning process, but I feel that media and methods work hand in hand if, used properly and objectives have been clearly stated. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 86 [Branch from no. 84] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 17:47 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Nicely said, Joe. I agree that methods work within media. I just don't know that media make methods work better. In my younger days, it seems to me that my teachers did just as well with their methods and limited media - blackboard and chalk etc. I enjoy the relation of a good story when it is told to me by the traditional storyteller, when I read it in a book, when I hear it on radio, when I watch it on tv, when I see it in a movie, when I watch it on IMAX .... Often the storytelling is the same - only the media changes. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 87 [Branch from no. 86] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 21:22 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess, I think you may have you may have put a little more into what I said. I quote from my previous posting; "Methods are important in the learning process, but I feel that media and methods work hand in hand if, used properly and objectives have been clearly stated." Quote from you reply; "In my younger days, it seems to me that my teachers did just as well with their methods and limited media - blackboard and chalk etc." Tess, you mentioned limited media worked well even just using blackboard and chalk. The media is used to emphasize the content, and not to over power it. The blackboard, and flash cards are indeed media. As I stated in my response to this question media has been around for quite a long time, I would say ancient times. As seen in cave dwellings images were drawn ro reflect a story. I feel these paintings were used to tell others a story. (media in old caves) Again, I mentioned methods and media working hand and hand to create an exceptional learning experience if done with care and understanding. I appreciate yor continued comments. Joe ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 98 [Branch from no. 87] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sat Apr 07, 2001 01:31 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 ok, Joe. The methods are the key. Media are supportive of the methods used in a well planned lesson, unit etc. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 100 [Branch from no. 98] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Sat Apr 07, 2001 11:11 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess, Did I read into your response a little sarcasm(?). If so, that is good. I want to elicit more responses to perhaps get more of us to research the subject more, so that we can all benefit. What are your thoughts on the following? I think that a less then good teacher can reach students well if he/she selects media by 'sure luck' that reflects the characteristics, competencies, and learning styles of the students attending his/her class. Joe ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 101 [Branch from no. 100] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 12:08 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess, Did I read into your response a little sarcasm(?). If so, that is good. I want to elicit more responses to perhaps get more of us to research the subject more, so that we can all benefit. What are your thoughts on the following? I think that a less then good teacher can reach students well if he/she selects media* by 'sure luck' that reflects the characteristics, competencies, and learning styles of the students attending his/her class. Addendum; *That would indicate his/her methods, grab a video, play the tape, with no regard for the students needs. No lecture, Q & A, or class participation. Joe ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 125 [Branch from no. 101] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 18:11 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 I get so sick of hearing on the media and now in this comment about the "less than good teacher". What is this? I do know some "less than good teachers", but fortunately, they are in the minority, as should by no means be lumped in with the "regular" and "good" teachers. To even qualify to be a good teacher and to maintain a minimum amount of control in a classroom, and to illisit interest of any kind, most "good" teachers have to be on their toes constantly, exploring for avenues to reach all students all of the time in all subjects. In other words most teachers are pretty close to being ubiquitous as a prerequisite to surviving in a "normal" classroom. Just stumbling onto a using piece of technology, doesn't just happen. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 128 [Branch from no. 125] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 13:40 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 You stated in your response to my posting as follows:ƒn "I get so sick of hearing on the media and now in this comment about the "less than good teacher". What is this? I do know some "less than good teachers", but fortunately, they are in the minority, as should by no means be lumped in with the "regular" and "good" teachers. To even qualify to be a good teacher and to maintain a minimum amount of control in a classroom, and to illicit interest of any kind, most "good" teachers have to be on their toes constantly, exploring for avenues to reach all students all of the time in all subjects. In other words most teachers are pretty close to being ubiquitous as a prerequisite to surviving in a "normal" classroom. Just stumbling onto a using piece of technology, doesn't just happen. Linda" 1. This was purely a hypothetical question. 2. I never lump anyone together, that to me is discrimination. 3. Even you stated that there are less then good teachers. And I say (Like any position), i.e.; cooks, laborers, et al. 4. Teachers have a tremendously difficult job to perform. To keep up with the changes in education that are currently going on. Some may even have fears of losing their jobs to technology. 5. You, like others have read more into what I write. Which follows: Let me clarify my statement for you: Remember this was and is a hypothetical scenario. Some teachers do not choose media judiciously. Some teachers are not comfortable around technology. My words on that particular posting: I think that a less then good teacher can reach students well if he/she selects media* by 'sure luck' that reflects the characteristics, competencies, and learning styles of the students attending his/her class. Addendum: *That would indicate his/her methods, grab a video, play the tape, with no regard for the students needs. No lecture, Q & A, or class participation. Having the idea that the students will absorb information in that way. Joe Oh, if anyone would like to comment, please feel free. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 134 [Branch from no. 128] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:38 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Joe: Just a comment, but grammatically, shouldn't it be, "less thAn good?" ;-) ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 162 [Branch from no. 134] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 18:15 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Patricia, Of course, I apologize for the incorrect word usage. Writing is not my forte. I depend on grammar and spell checkers. No one else has said anything, so lets keep it between you and me.LOL Joe ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 133 [Branch from no. 125] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:35 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Linda I agree. Teachers today have unique challenges dealing with the constant rate of change going on all around us. Beyond just learning styles, IQs, and semester objectives, teachers today have to be more cognizant of a greater realm of topics: legal issues, cultural backgrounds, ethnicity, religion, family models, socio-economic status, disciplinary actions, psychology, and, unfortunately, gun control. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 146 [Branch from no. 133] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:51 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 I really hesitate to say this but Canada has one less problem - with very rare exceptions - gun control is not much of a problem. Putting it differently, because of our gun control, we have fewer problems with guns. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 148 [Branch from no. 146] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 03:43 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess, I good comment Technology can also, unfortunately be a negative influence to learning, but that is a cultural problem. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 145 [Branch from no. 125] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:44 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 I agree, Linda!! ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 144 [Branch from no. 101] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:42 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 sort of like a monkey typing Romeo and Juliet if he typed often enough? Of course, the chance factor could just as easily happen with the really good teacher! Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 149 [Branch from no. 144] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 03:46 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess, I supposse. I should also add we all have our bad days and when that happens, it does affect student performance. Technology could help or aide on those days when wwe have no more strenth, to be a god and a teaacher. ( which to me seems today has to be synonomus) Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 132 [Branch from no. 100] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:29 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Joe: While I understand your point, I would like to think that even a "less than good instructor" would not select any media via just "sure luck." ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 163 [Branch from no. 132] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 19:38 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Patricia, Yes, most educators would not do that. But, I would have to disagree and say that I have had at least one teacher who appeared to do just that. Everyone is missing the real point of my response, which appears in the final paragraph in that response. Which was that there was no student teacher interaction, no class discussion, et al. Just the showing of a video to the students. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 164 [Branch from no. 163] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Fri Apr 13, 2001 08:49 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Joe: I am sure I understood your point. I think one of the draw backs of this type of media, is that when you push someone's buttons on a topic, whatever it may be, that people will react to those first. And sometimes, while unfortunate, in a response, the actual point of the message being responded to may not be addressed. While I think this also happens in REAL time (face to face) interactions, I think because of the length of time between exchanges in this medium, that it is difficult to get people back on task, without sounding like you are "beating a dead horse." So, I guess my point is to not get frustrated. If the dialogue could go on, we could all be brought up to speed, and on the same page, but it is a process. And, like all other processes, you must trust in it enough to allow it to work. This is probably a good lesson to keep in mind for all of us. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 143 [Branch from no. 100] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:39 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 The luck may be more that his methods match those that fit his class. My husband told me a story once that made him uncomfortable with some of educational "fads" as he put it. Of course, he is happy to use any method - old, new, whatever works. He was taught two years in high school -Grades 11 and 12 by a very traditional Social Studies teacher. He said that he had not particularly liked History until then. The lectures and notes of the teacher were very well set up and he listened with growing interest and reviewed his notes (dictated) each night. He then became a history teacher himself but learned the discovery approach where lecturing was considered taboo, and very bad. He tried to fit in and did. A few years later after he had completed graduate work and was a principal, he ran into his old teacher who tried to apologize to him for his horrible old ways. My husband tried to tell him that he (the teacher) was his inspiration but his old teacher just kept trying to recant. Finally, his old teacher said rather sadly "you mean that there was some good in it?" My husband said that it reminded him of Galileo and then had to explain that to me! ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 150 [Branch from no. 143] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 03:50 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess, Anedotes and hind sight often reveal a great deal. Even teachers can learn from their mistakes and that includes the use and misuse of technology in schools. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 168 [Branch from no. 150] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sun Apr 15, 2001 15:19 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Yes, teachers often learn from their mistakes. I frequently hear teachers talk about their lessons etc in the staffroom and say that that didn't work and that maybe they will try something else. Other teachers join in with suggestions, lessons, materials etc ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 160 [Branch from no. 143] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 15:02 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess: Good point. While methods and strategies might change, I think we need to take care not to mis-label practitioners of current methods as "bad," or "wrong." They are just different. I think the benefit of learning new techniques is to be able to add things to your teacher/trainer toolbox. It does not mean, to me, that you completely disregard older/other methods. Like the fact that not every tool will work for every project, the more tools you have to select from the better equipped you will be to handle a multitude of projects. (This can easily be translated to training methods in conjunction with technology, and students -- respectively.) It is important to recognize that not all students prefer to learn in an auditory environment for example, so the varied ways you can take to present the exact same material, will actually reach a much broader audience. I think it is all about delivering the right message, at the right time, in the right place, for the right people, with the right tools. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 124 [Branch from no. 98] posted by Leslie Wilson (cgljw) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 17:31 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 I agree with Joe, Methods are the key!! Les ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 126 [Branch from no. 124] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 18:13 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Les, Methods, instruction, support, medium, media, etc. etc,no one thing singularly will aide in the cocept of "learning". They all in combination influence learning. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 127 [Branch from no. 124] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 19:36 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Les, I think you may have read something in writings that lead you to thr response you supplied. Quote "I agree with Joe, Methods are the key!! Les" I am just the opposite, 'Methods' alone are only part of the big picture. Without media 'Methods' would be lost.More on this tomorrow(4-09-2001). I think that a less then good teacher can reach students well if he/she selects media* by 'sure luck' that reflects the characteristics, competencies, and learning styles of the students attending his/her class. Addendum; *That would indicate his/her methods, grab a video, play the tape, with no regard for the students needs. No lecture, Q & A, or class participation. Joey ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 131 [Branch from no. 86] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:25 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion: March 29 to April 11 Tess: Good point about media making methods working. One area that might support this is in the realm of artificial intelligence. While it is based on extensive research of human decision making patterns it just might be able to make methods work. e.g. A computerized robot responding to roadside emergencys. (This was actually test piloted on a university campus in California last July -- I don't recall if it was UCLA or somewhere in San Diego.) ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 64 posted by Leslie Wilson (cgljw) on Sat Mar 24, 2001 17:04 Subject Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson I believe that from the articles that I have read and the studies that I have made, evidence does not yet appear to support the claim that media influences the process of learning. The evidence that the media attributes to the learning process in any way is not a proven fact. I think media definately contributes several important factors, but only structional methods used by a teacher will influence the learning process! Learning is an active, cognitive process. The use of media is a support process. It is the material in the instructional program that is important, not the presentation. The media is a tool for learning. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 73 [Branch from no. 64] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Mon Apr 02, 2001 22:12 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Les: While I see your point, consider this. Have you ever seen a child pick up a "Gameboy?" If so, did you also notice that there was no instructor, no pre-planned method, no format -- just the "technology" -- so to speak. Granted this technology was intended for "fun," can you really say that "no" learning occurred? ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 79 [Branch from no. 73] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 22:38 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Learning likely comes from almost any interaction. However, it does not mean that acertian medium in itself promotes superior learning. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 117 [Branch from no. 79] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:28 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Tess, I agree. Learning can take place any place any time and under many circumstances. It is finding and using those "teaching moments" to the benefit of students. It just doesn't occur within the confines of a particular time frame. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 116 [Branch from no. 73] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:25 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Les and Patricia, Not all learning is positive. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 76 [Branch from no. 64] posted by Cynthia Cloutier (cucec4) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 15:38 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Leslie, I agree that the material in the instructional program is very, if not the most, important. But how it is presented to the learner/student is also important. Two different presentations: #1 The teacher has the material on paper and stands in front of the class and reads it off to them in a monotone voice. The class is expected to sit quietly,listen, and take some notes. #2 The teacher and class read the material together in class, taking turns reading and stopping for discussion. The students are given handouts to take home of the same material. The teacher has also prepared a slide presentation to go along with the subject matter of the material--the slides are very interesting. Two different presentations of the same material--the methods are different and so is the media used. I think that the students are going to learn much more with #2 and probably not even pay attention to #1. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 81 [Branch from no. 76] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 22:43 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Wouldn't the comparison be between a. The teacher reading the material to the class (does it have to be in a monotone?) and b. The teacher reading to the class via a video ( same expression of voice) Then we are comparing apples to apples ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 89 [Branch from no. 81] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 22:23 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Tess: While you are correct in stating that the two scenarios are the same in respect to the "reading" scenario, even if monotone, that in-person or video would be similar. If applied to V-A-K, this would be suitable for visual, and auditory learners. In taking a different perspective, what is VERY different between the two is that only hand-outs were provided in scenario 1 -- this appeals to left-brain dominant learners. In scenario 2, though, the slides that were provided, which likely included pictures or graphics of some sort -- help frame the message in a way right-brained dominant learners prefer. And when applied to V-A-K, not only are Visual, and Auditory students' needs STILL met, but the Kinesthetic learner's needs are now met TOO. A graphic can engage a sense of movement for these types of learners. Studies have shown that approximately 25%% of all learners are kinesthetic -- can you see that in the first scenario, without the media, 25%% of the classroom would have been left out? If a learner's needs are not met early on, they wil "check-out" so to speak. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 96 [Branch from no. 89] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sat Apr 07, 2001 01:22 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Thus showing that it is the method that matters and not the media? ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 119 [Branch from no. 96] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:34 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Sometimes the answer to that is yes Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 121 [Branch from no. 96] posted by Cynthia Cloutier (cucec4) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 15:42 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson I believe it is showing that they both matter. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 154 [Branch from no. 121] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 04:06 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson So true Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 118 [Branch from no. 81] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:33 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson You would be surprized just how creative and expressive teachers can get when they have a wonderfully, caring, relationship with their students. When a teacher has that close relationship with a group of her students, behind closed doors, drama, laughter, and risk taking occurs. Learning is also a risk taking experience for some students. They are willing to take that risk if they know that they are in a safe and caring environment, with or without the use of media. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 140 [Branch from no. 118] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:12 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson I agree. One of the most loving and caring teachers is a teacher that we got out of retirement here. She is old fashioned and rather strict but still very loving. She is somewhat 19th century but the kids really learn and they like doing it. She was our 2 children's first teacher and we are very appreciative of her. My son has had her for 3 years now, as a K4, a K5 and a Grade 1. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 159 [Branch from no. 140] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 14:50 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Tess: Consider this. While she may "be" a little 19th century, do you really think her teaching style is? If the kids, today, like her as much as you imply, my guess is that she is probably a little more 21st century than you are giving her credit for. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 165 [Branch from no. 159] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sun Apr 15, 2001 15:01 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson You are right - she keeps up nicely but still maintains a comparitively old fashioned discipline which I like! Heaven only knows, my little son is a sweet rascal who sometimes needs it. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 122 [Branch from no. 81] posted by Cynthia Cloutier (cucec4) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 15:55 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson No, in example one the teacher does not have to read in monotone. I was just trying to give an example of two different presentations of the same material and how the two presentations might differ. Each uses a different method and different media. This is to show that presentation DOES count. The presentations are different whether or not the first instructor speaks in monotone. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 155 [Branch from no. 122] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 04:09 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Cynthia, Presesntation does make a difference. Like I said earlier, we all can have a bad day and I know that isn't fair to our students. But hopefully, there are ways to combat that. Technology uses can help. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 88 [Branch from no. 76] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 22:12 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Cindy: I have to say that since your second scenario engages more senses, that it is certainly more likely that the students in general will retain more of the infomation presented. (This is a key to accelerate learning, and moving information to long-term memory.) However, I don't think I could whole heartedly say, that absolutely NO learning occurred in your first scenario. Primarily because I know there are students who do have a preference to learning in that style. In fact, that is precisely why instructors, especially, should learn and know about their own preferences, as it is likely to be the one they will first choose to teach in. Yet, it is their responsibility as an instructor to realize that a strength, overused, becomes a weakness, and to be sensitive to the learning styles of the audience. Though, I will agree, that given your two options, the second scenario is likely to touch more learners in the audience. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 80 [Branch from no. 64] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 22:39 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Les, I am inclined to agree. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 94 [Branch from no. 64] posted by Joseph Decaro (csjcd) on Fri Apr 06, 2001 22:33 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Les, I have to disagree with you, there have been studies with the outcome supporting media influences or at least enhances the learning process. And I also beleive the media does in fact influence and enhance the learning process when done correctly. Following is an example from a book I have done research with on this topic which shows that children do react to visual stimuli. In other cases, one symbol system may be call on bettermastered recoding skills then another. Chandler, Greenspan, and Barenoim (1973) tested six-and-seven year olds' moral judgements either by verbally describing to them the traditional moral dilemmas or by displaying them on television. "Special care was exercised to ensure that no detail was present in the films which was not equally available in the written stories". Exposure to the verbally presented dilemmas yielded the traditional finding that children at that age center on action consequences but not on intentions. Contrary to the traditional findings, exposure to the video taped pictorial stories resulted in the childrens' centering on both the intentions and consequences, thus exhibiting more advanced moral judgment for that age. Note how symbol-system dependent the results were. It can be argued that, as the recoding skills required by the verbally presented information were less well mastered, more information was lost on lost or lost saliency. The video presentation called on bettermastered recoding skills; since its symbols were more congruent with the childrens' schemata than verbal descriptions were, television allowed subsequent elaboration of more of the information provided. Salomon, Gavriel. Interaction of Media, Cognition, and Learning. Hillsdale, NJ: Lawrence Erlbaum Associates, 1994. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 97 [Branch from no. 94] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sat Apr 07, 2001 01:23 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Very interesting Joe. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 115 [Branch from no. 64] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 17:24 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Les, Media can be used as a supportive tool to learning. But any medium or techniques that work, can be considered successful. The problem is finding the correct combination with each student. That key seems to be elusive. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 135 [Branch from no. 115] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:50 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson Linda: The right combination for each student is precisely the key. This is why cost effective media selection is important. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 156 [Branch from no. 135] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 04:10 Subject Re: Media Influences vs. The Process of Learning - Les Wilson You are correct. An example could be the ITI system. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 69 posted by Leslie Wilson (cgljw) on Fri Mar 30, 2001 16:22 Subject Media Influence Discussion Liza, I agree that the articles were confusing, but interesting. What evidence supports that media influences learning? Les Wilson ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 71 [Branch from no. 69] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Mon Apr 02, 2001 22:04 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion Les, what evidence supports that media does not result in learning? ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 82 [Branch from no. 71] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 22:45 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion exactly, we are arguing about something that has little proof. Mind you, if it does have an influence, you would think that it would have shown up more decisively by now. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 105 [Branch from no. 82] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:41 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion Patricia and Tess, I have in the past conducted my own "experiments" with my own children, using "game boy" and Nintendo. I have seen that given the choice all 3 of my children have reacted completely differently to this "media". One played it only periodly, even when given uncontrolled choices. The other played for days and finally realized that if he stayed up late the next morning he would be very tired, and grew more so as the week and weeks passed and finally decided that the natural consequences of being tired in exchange for the "fun" of it at night wasn't worth it. Another son was not able to physically stop playing and I do believe became addicted to this "media". It had negative effects on this child. His behavior after prolonged use was effected. The other two could care less. They had more impoortant things to do. Curiously, the third child , after we REMOVED this type of technology, permanently. .eventially did regain a normal sleep pattenrn, and activity, and disposition. By allowing the natural consequences over a period of time the responses to this type of "media" was interesting to observe. The results in my opinion again is that it boils down to choices, and variable. Some can contol the choices and outcomes, while others cannot. Media did definaately make an influence. This was not just a one time "experiment". I would be willing to take a bet that other parents have conducted their own experiments as well on the influences of media. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 120 [Branch from no. 105] posted by Cynthia Cloutier (cucec4) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 15:32 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion Linda, Very interesting example. I believe that media influences learning, just because I do, I guess I'm one of those people that doesn't have to have proof. So, therefore, I guess I wouldn't make a very good scientist! ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 136 [Branch from no. 105] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:54 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion Linda: Thanks for sharing! Very interesting observations. I bet other parents have observed similar behaviors -- I wonder, though, how many had the patience to let the process run its course. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 141 [Branch from no. 105] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:21 Subject Re: Media Influence Discussion Thank you for sharing. I appreciate the testimony! Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 77 posted by Leslie Wilson (cgljw) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 16:03 Subject Media Influence Patricia: I just believe media is an influencing factor, but learning is a true cognitive process. Does media contribute...I think so. Interesting question! I'm going to do some research on the topic! Les ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 90 [Branch from no. 77] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 22:28 Subject Re: Media Influence Les: I agree that learning is a cognitive process, but think the GameBoy example is interesting because I have seen children pick it up and literally learn how the application / game works, with NO method/ process exllained to them in the periphery. So maybe, then, the method is built in to the media? I think I will need to do some research too. :-) ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 78 posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Wed Apr 04, 2001 22:27 Subject Media's influence on learning I dislike black and white choices. However, since it is required, I feel that media has no influence on learning. My arguments are few. It is just my life experience that the media doesn't seem to matter - it is more of the approach of the instructor etc. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 91 [Branch from no. 78] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Thu Apr 05, 2001 22:30 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning Tess: If you are posing that it is more the influence of the instructor, then I would like to pose the Game Boy example I threw Les in a previous message to you too. What are your thoughts? ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 104 [Branch from no. 91] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:30 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning Patricia, In the game boy senario, I believe that that is just an avenue of escape and children see this as merely play. Unfortunately, this type of play can have detrimental consequences. This type of media does influence learning, negatively. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 137 [Branch from no. 104] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 22:59 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning Linda: I realize that this media was designed for fun, but think it is interesting that learning occured without any structured method applied -- negative (unfortunately) or otherwise. I guess I am thinking that this same type of media could be utilized to learn spelling, reading, geography, history, foreign language, and other topics by "tweaking" (a highly technical term you know) the application / game. What are your thoughts? ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 157 [Branch from no. 137] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 04:16 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning Patricia, Students today are so used to instant gratification that technology used in that sense and applied in the content courses would "grab" their attention. That's all we really want is that "gotya" incentive. That is the most difficult part of teaching is to get their attention and to keep it long enough to give information to them that is useful. If this type of technology could be used as a "trick" of the trade and it was effective, I would try it. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 103 [Branch from no. 78] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:28 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning Tess, I agree with you that the approach the instructor used can have a profound affect on students. However, I disagree with you that media does not influence learning in some way. Linda ;) ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 99 posted by Leslie Wilson (cgljw) on Sat Apr 07, 2001 10:05 Subject Media Influence on Learning Patricia: I also agree with Tess on the impact of the instructor on learning and not the media format. As for the gameboy, you might explain the concept behind the game. Les ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 102 posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Sun Apr 08, 2001 16:24 Subject Media's influence on learning The question that is posed is , "Do I believe or not believe that media has an influence on learning." or "What is the potential relationship between learning and media?' As I understand it we are to take a personal stand on the issue. Before I can do that I would like to say that I agreed with Zozma's definition of what learning was. "Learning is an ACTIVE, constructive, cognitive and SOCIAL process by which the learner strategically manages available cognitive, physical, and SOCIAL resources to create new knowledge by interacting with information in the environment and integrating it with information already stored in memory." To me that was a perfect definition of learning. Even under the most conducive, controlled situations there are too many variables that can influence the answer to be a simple "yes" or a "no". I DO concur that media DOES influence learning. In our culture, in an American society, "communication" in the form of media inundates our every waking and sleeping moment, whether we choose to use it or not. The influence is still there. In Richard Clark's article he made the claim that "media do not influence learning or motivation". I would like to ask him what about the low level achievers in my classroom. What about the title one students, or unmotivated students. What about the students that come to school and complain that they are hungry and can't think of anything except getting something to eat? What about the students who are to lazy, but capable? Finally, what about the students that would be left to their own devices to succeed in the class room, if they didn't have technical help because of their learning disabilities? Should we not attempt as educators to use ANY media or medium or method, that works or that has the possibiltity of helping a student to learn or succeed? Not all media or mediums of instruction will be affective/effective on all students because of the vast individual needs and learning styles of all learners, regardless of age. In all classrooms today, from preschool to college and beyond, the needs and ability and learning style gaps are widening to be such a chasm that one educator in one classroom will find it difficult to meet the needs of all of their students. If that educator has to teach the basic core subjects plus all of the other "mandated" material in a days time, that educator literally must become "all things to all people". It is am overwhelming task, for just one individual to accomplish successfully. Today's educators are being held accountable if a student does or does not learn. Additional variables can be for older students, family problems, emotional problems, drug and alcohol problems, and you know the list goes on and on. Media does influence students lives. However, it cannot force a child to learn, just as clarks delivery truck cannot physically provide nutrition for us all. We can use media to deliver the "message" or skill or attribute or intended goal that is to be learned. Ultimately, it may or may not be up to the learner to choose to use the type of media/medium to acquire a specific type or piece of knowledge. One example would be that we use our computer in our classroom to encourage reading through a program called Accelerated Reading. Students spend their time on the computer for a varitey of reasons. Some like to see that they have learned, or comprehended the setting, details,ect., in a story or novel. When they earn so many points,they earn rewards. Just like Pavlovs dogs. It is a positive reinforcement for the correct response. However, I have students that read, or do not read and want to take an accelerated reading test to just get out of their seat to do something different, or to get out of the work they are corrently doing. I have a very gifted student who just wants to go to the computer to play. He hasn't passed a test this whole year. He doesn't care. On the other hand I have one student that has earned more points in the third grade, than all of the 6th graders combined. He loves to read, he is self motivataed, and he loves and is accomplished at using the computer. There are students in my classroom that do not like using the computer for Accerlated Reading tests. These students have a low self esteem and are not happy with using technology to test their skill level. Salomon, 1979 wrote, "An instructional method, is any way to shape information that ACTIVATES, supplants or compensates for the cognitive processes necessary for achievement or motivation." In a text book,study, or theory, one may be able to separate media/mediium from instruction, but not in the real world. In both articles reference was made to "drill and practice" in a learning activity. Media/medium/technology will enter into this type of rote learning. It is not a bad thing. Drill and practice or rote learning is a tool that is used to build the foundation in elementary school, so students can function at a higher lever of thinking in later years. The media/medium that we use is ever changing at an alarming exponential rate, as is the educational instrucional methods. At times they may seem to be in conflict with one another. What methods and instruments are used varies with the age of the learner. The bottom line is "media does influence learning". How the learner chooses to react to the media or medium may not have anything to do with the instructor or the learning process. As I mentioned early, the variables that each student brings to school on that ONE particular day in that ONE particular school year, will influence the effectiveness or lack of the media/medium or method of learning in that particular minute, on that particular day, of that particular school year. All of those variables may be beyond the control of the educator. However, like Clarks truck that delivers the food. We as educators have to keep delivering the nutritional "message" in a VARIETY of ways so that on one particular day, a student does make the choice to "take a bite" of knowledge. Both authors arguments are inconsequential, if a student chooses not to to take that bite, because of one of those variables. (Haven't we all seen the "glow" a student exhibits when they have learned something and the idea . . . clicks!!! Their eyes light up and sparkle. Learning can be a powerful tool, and media can be a tool, it is not the only avenue. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 142 [Branch from no. 102] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:28 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning Linda, I really like what you say. We have to keep trying by many methods and many media and see what works for a student who is likely being affected by many things out of our control. Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 158 [Branch from no. 142] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 04:20 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning Tess, I agree we just have to keep trying. But that is what is so wonderful about teachers. They never give up!!!! They get tired but never give up!!! Technology and a variety of media/medium helps!! Teachers are cool people, aren't they??!!!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :) ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 166 [Branch from no. 158] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sun Apr 15, 2001 15:02 Subject Re: Media's influence on learning They sure are! Being involved in my husband's schools made me decide to join in! Tess ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 123 posted by Leslie Wilson (cgljw) on Mon Apr 09, 2001 17:29 Subject Media Influence Learning Linda: On your posting dated 4/8/01 you made several important points. I agree media should be used as a tool for learning today! I agree with Zozma's defination of what learning is. What evidence is their that proves media influences learning? Can you site any scientific proof? Les ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 129 posted by Leslie Wilson (cgljw) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 19:18 Subject Influence of Media on Learning This is my lsast posting! I have posted my opinion every other day for the last 14 days! I've read just about everyones responses. I believe I've been posting my responses Under "All", not the correct date. Oh well! Methods work within media. Does media make methods work better? My past teachers used blackboards and chalk. Did we learn any less? Today I use PowerPoint, an overhead, whiteboard, software programs, computer simulations, writing labs, charts, the internet and computer generated notes. Do my students comprehend more? I hope so!! Only test scores in comparison will answer that. Is that a fair evaluation???? I've enjoyed reading your postings! Les ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 139 [Branch from no. 129] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Tue Apr 10, 2001 23:08 Subject Re: Influence of Media on Learning Les: I don't think that by comparing test scores alone would solidify your proof. There are a number of other variables outside the classroom that also contribute to whether or not learning occurs (or is better now than in the past) == beyond just the use of media / technology. See Linda's latest post for a few examples. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 147 [Branch from no. 129] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 03:38 Subject Re: Influence of Media on Learning Les, I do not believe test scores are a good iindicator of a students progress. I have had many students in my classes that just cannot take tests. Then I have had students that just cannot take tests under time constraints. Then I have had students that have a bad day, panic, and just cannot adhere to the perimeters of the lovely state tests. This applies to the SAT's as well. When you see the test results of a student that you KNOW is gifted or that is very intelligent and they bomb the test, you know that something is wrong. Then again, you have the students that think that tests are a waste of time and spend time just shading in circles to make a colorful or "nice" pattern. So I DO not believe that the test results of a student, that is taken on only one day during the school year is a good indicator of a students potential or abiltiy. I believe that a chronological portfolio of students work taken under "normal" conditions is a better assessment of a students ability or potential. Linda ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 161 [Branch from no. 147] posted by Patricia Mejia (cupem) on Wed Apr 11, 2001 15:09 Subject Re: Influence of Media on Learning Linda: Couldn't agree with you more. In fact, I have recently heard discussion supporting doing away with tests like the GRE, MCAT, LSAT, etc. The argument being that these exams not only have socio-economic bias, but also only measure success predictors for the first few years, not long term success in advanced degree programs. The key would be to attain buy-in from the Ivy League schools, as they are the ones that seem to blaze the path. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 167 [Branch from no. 147] posted by Teresita Rodnunsky (cutr) on Sun Apr 15, 2001 15:09 Subject Re: Influence of Media on Learning If you will forgive a foreigner, I speculate that all of these tests are partially motivated by a distrust of teacher evaluations. They seem to want some other authority to make a ruling. It seems a shame that this takes place. American teachers are well trained and quite professional. ------------------------------------------------------------ Message no. 169 [Branch from no. 167] posted by Linda Maden-biava (cgllm1) on Tue Apr 17, 2001 21:51 Subject Re: Influence of Media on Learning Tess, What a thought provoking comment!! You hit the nail right on the head. I have found that "teachers", freely, verbally, and repeatedly, give their opinions on many issues. I see (my perspective) teachers as being realistic visionaries, and truth tellers. That combination is something that politicians to not like. (Because we tell it like it is.) I agree with you that MOST educators are and can be trusted, since evaluations is part of the game. (OOPS, did I say games, I meant to say job, pardon me.) Unfortunately, in this country, we have some cultural biases against females. Since teaching is primarily a "female" occupation, I see this discrimination or prejuidice or bias, increasing in this country. Bias , prejudices, or discriminations seem to increase in this country, (or for that matter other countries), when the economics in that country becomes shakey. Politicians look for political scapegoats, and teachers are an easy target since we have to rely on public funding, they think we have to take it. Educators are trying to continually improve their skills, while the public, to whom we are accountable, ddo not have to live up to any ones accountability. This is a question I pose to my principal all of the time. When do we as educators have to, or when can be get parents to be accountable to us? ONe way is to increase the lines of communication. Technology can serve that purpose as a beginning type of diplomacy to get them to understand that we all have the same goal, at least we do, to get the kids to think and learn. Tess, Your perception of our American culture regarding learning and teachers is right on target!!!!! Linda M.B. ------------------------------------------------------------